I am Reformed because of one thing: Consistently, honestly, and thoroughly read, God’s Word, the Bible, teaches that God is sovereign over all things, that man is a fallen creature, and that God saves perfectly in Jesus Christ. It is the consistent application of sola Scriptura (Scripture alone) and tota Scriptura (all of Scripture) that leads inevitably to the doctrines of grace.
– James White
This is indeed what the Scripture teaches!
Question: Why do some of the more ultra reformed guys prepose that one must be a cessaionist and prescribe to the entire reformation worship stance to be deemed reformed?
I am eager to hear anything on this. I have my own stance but am eager to hear from those out there……..
Another way of looking at it its:
Who do you thank for your salvation?
Do I say to God: “You did Your part, I did mine” ?
Who gets the glory then?
Instead, I say “The Rock broke me, and then saved me.”
God alone gets all the credit and the glory.
“1 And you were dead in the trespasses and sins 2 in which you once walked, following the course of this world, following the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that is now at work in the sons of disobedience— 3among whom we all once lived in the passions of our flesh, carrying out the desires of the body and the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, like the rest of mankind.
“4But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, 5even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ— by grace you have been saved— 6and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, 7so that in the coming ages he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus.
“8For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.”
(Sorry about the double post…)
Are you referring to charismatic churches?
– Jeff H
I like it. Powerful and effective. Short and sweet.
Not Charasmatic specifically.
Just want to know: Why do some of the more ultra reformed guys prepose that one must be a cessaionist and prescribe to the entire reformation worship stance to be deemed reformed?
I’m still trying to understand your question completely. I’ll take a stab at it and you correct me:
Regarding ‘cessation’: if you are speaking of spiritual gifts, then yes, most reformists believe that the spiritual gifts described in Mark 16, Acts, and 1 Corinthians were ‘meant for those people at that time’.
Specifically, the Holy Spirit gave Gospel messengers the ability to speak a foreign (to the speaker) language, that was native to the audience. This was used to validate the speaker and his message, as one from God.
As for “entire reformation worship stance”: I’m not really sure what you mean here. If you are referring to liturgical worship services, these can vary quite a bit from church to church, so…
This was why I was trying to determine if you were asking about ‘reformed’ churches, for example, vs. charismatic.
Both the way church services are conducted and the churches’ views concerning spiritual gifts will be QUITE different in that example.
Are you asking about Communion? Baptism? Other sacraments? Doctrine of election? Eschatology (what the Bible says about the end times)?
If I’m still way off base in answering your question, please be patient with me and give me some specific guidance.
Thanks for taking the time to respond.
I am quite aware of the details (views on what the”perfect” actually is etc) involved with cessation as opposed to continuation.
What I am asking, -it is something that puzzles me-, is why must somebody only be deemed reformed when they believe that the gifts have ceased?
Hence the term ‘reformed charismatic’.
An ultra-reformed person, and by ultra I mean exactly that, would say that embracing the 5 points of Calvinism and the 5 Solas does not make you reformed. Unless you are a cessationist, adhere to a reformational type of worship and so forth you are not reformed they would say. you are not reformed.
I know that the argument goes that, ‘Sola Scriptura leads to the logical conclusion that cessation is biblical’. Yet I disagree.
I believe one can be reformed and not a cessationist.