Your Thursday sermon of the week is God Saves Bad People by Art Azurdia. This is a great message on Rahab and this sermon has even been made into a sermon jam that’s been featured on DefCon.
Those of you unfamiliar with Art Azurdia will find him a refreshing voice in a wilderness of Osteens, Nobles, Driscolls, and Warrens.
Christ Alone Wyoming 
Great Sermon! I am happy God saves bad people like me.
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Amen papapatriot. Praise His name always for saving lost sinners like us!
I’m still listening to this. I’m not sure if his justification for Rahab lying not being condemned anywhere else in the bible is a justification for saying that it wasn’t a wrong thing to do. There are a number of accounts in the bible where people did bad things and the bible doesn’t necessarily condemn it but we shouldn’t assume that God approves because the bible doesn’t condemn it. Sometimes the bible gives an account or a description and just because it doesn’t condemn it, it is not the same as an endorsement.
I am not going to go out on a limb and say Rahab was wrong for lying. I’ve heard Todd on Wretched Radio say that its not wrong to lie if the request isn’t a reasonable one but I’m not sure where he’s getting his justification for that? For example, if you are hiding Jews in your basement during WWII and a Nazi comes to your door and ask you if you are hiding Jews then you would be right to lie per the request not being a reasonable one. I don’t think anyone would say yes if Nazis asked them about the Jews in their basement but I also don’t think the justification is because it wasn’t a reasonable request. The bible says to tell the truth out of love. If you were to tell the Nazis about the Jews in your basement for the sake of telling truth, it wouldn’t have been out of love for obvious reasons.
I am curious as to any comments any of you may have on this?
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Wade:
It must be remembered that Rahab was neither under the law (not being an Israelite), nor under grace (not a Christian). Was she therefore free to sin? Was she wrong to lie? Does her lying to save the spies make her any less bad than her harlotry, and who knows what else she was doing? People have tried to use this, and other examples to condone “mental reservation” (a teaching which says it’s okay to lie, if it’s for the “greater good”). Same goes for Liberation Theology, which advocates killing “for the greater good”. Or how about the Mafia guy who kills off his competition, yet gives generously to benevolent organizations (do his “good” deeds outweigh his bad)? Man has a tendency to transgress God’s commands by reasoning it’s okay if for a “greater good”. And that degenerates quickly from “the greater good” to MY greater good.
The thought therefore regarding hiding Jews from the Nazis is hypothetical. In the real world, we must diligently keep God’s word, and pray for wisdom in circumstances He allows for us. We must never cross over to thinking it’s okay to sin in this or that situation.
Just my 2 cents 🙂
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A beautiful sermon that brought tears to my eyes, and brought hope and joy to my heart. May we all weep over our sin, and rejoice in our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. Knowing that our Savior saves to the uttermost, and that He is much greater as a Savior, Deliverer, Redeemer, and Giver of eternal life, than any and all our sin condemns us to an eternal death and torment in hell forever.
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Stay tuned for next week’s sermon of the week (01/14/10) on this very topic that you guys have brought up: Lying and Rahab’s lie.
The speaker will be Phil Johnson.
– The Pilgrim
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Thank you Pilgrim; it will be a treat to hear Phil Johnson talk about this. 🙂
Thank you for your response DavidW; you’ve given me things to consider. Thank you also for providing examples I had never heard of before; i.e. “Mental Reservation” & “Liberation Theology”. Really both Mental Reservation & Liberation Theology sound like pragmatism to me. Unfortunately pragmatism is a huge problem in our churches today and I don’t think we hear enough about the evils of it. Pragmatism is responsible for all of the church programs we use to trick people into church so we can sucker them into responding to an alter call so we can make yet another false convert. Pragmatism is responsible for the loose language that plagues our churches; for example, asking people to make a decision for Jesus instead of telling them that they must believe and have faith!
I really will look forward to the Phil Johnson sermon because on one hand I think its wrong for Rahab to lie but on the other hand I think she did the right thing to protect the spies. I also think, however, that even though she wasn’t under the law or under grace she still had the law written on her heart and her conscience served her as a guide and therefore still responsible for her actions. I’m not here to condemn Rahab because I’m a sinner saved by grace the same as she is. I suspect that the answer to all of this has something to do with how God can use the wrongful actions of people acting on their own accord to serve His will; the same as how He used Joseph’s brothers’ jealousy and hatred to bring Joseph to Egypt as well as raising up nations to conquer Israel per Israel’s iniquities. Afterall, the same as mentioned in the sermon, Rahab’s actions were of such scale and consequence that it allowed her to become a part of Jesus’ lineage.
A lot to consider! Thank you again!
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Wade – I agree with you and your example is valid as this happened time and time again not only in Germany but throughout history with Christians being public enemy #1. So too it will happen again.
As another example, think of William Tyndale and the countless others whom we have to thank for the Scriptures in our native tongue which dealt a deadly blow to the Roman beast. If he and the others involved in this task, including the hiding of documents and persons, “told the truth” and did not break the law by lying and translating the Bible we’d have no Bible today.
The same thing happens in countless communist countries today where it is ILLEGAL to have a Bible. Should these believers turn in their Bibles and tell the truth? Should they tell their leaders and authorities where they are meeting or hiding other believers so they can be taken away and killed and tortured? Should those in the US who have contact with such lawbreakers do the “right” thing and turn these rebels in? I trow not.
There are countless other examples that can be cited; the Egyptian midwives being a perfect example who did not bend knee to Pharaoh and lied to him to spare the Hebrew children who were not only commended in the Scriptures but were blessed by God. So too did Moses mother break the law by not killing her son. Should she have obeyed the law and had him killed? What about Mary and Joseph hiding in Egypt to spare the Lord?
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brother Michael:
There is a difference between breaking the law of man, and breaking God’s commandments for us. Peter and the early apostles broke the law by preaching Jesus, under the argument that we must obey God rather than man. But that is entirely different than lying, which is God’s command, which we dare not break (no liars shall enter the kingdom of heaven). Again, when Rahab lied, when the Hebrew midwives lied, the law was not yet given. That does not mean that God approves of unrighteousness for us today. The fact that He used Pharaoh, Joseph’s brothers, slave traders, Potiphar, and countless others to accomplish His will does not in any way endorse what any of these individuals did. That Moses murdered an Egyptian does not condone what he did, yet God used him for His purpose.
Regarding those who are in countries where Christianity, or the bible is illegal, that does not mean we need to wave a flag over our heads or shout in the street “look everyone, I’m a Christian, I’ve got a bible”. But lie about it? Where do we find any instruction in the Scriptures to do that? We cannot take historical examples and use those as precident to say these individuals were right in lying or committing any sin because it was for a greater good.
We must be careful not to let situation ethics govern which commandments of God we keep, and which we let slide “for the greater good”.
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Thank you brother Michael for your thought provoking response and wonderful examples!
I think all of the examples you have cited have one thing in common. They were all selfless acts. They were all in service to God, in service to His kingdom! With that being said, I agree wtih DavidW’s comment about how we can get sucked into thinking its okay to lie because its for the greater good and then before we know it, its turning into our greater good; all of which sounds like it could turn into a slippery slope very quickly. We shouldn’t make justifications or excuses to sin but at the same time we shouldn’t ignore our conscience that acts as a guide as it is bearing witness (Romans 2:15) and let’s not forget; “Paul looked straight at the Sanhedrin and said, “My brothers, I have fulfilled my duty to God in all good conscience to this day.” Acts 23:1
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DavidW – Personally, I don’t believe this is a case of situational ethics at all. If the govt. says that all Christians must turn in their Bibles and self-identify and they consciously do not, then they have in fact lied and not told the truth. There is no getting around this.
Also, the Egyptians lied, there is no getting around this either and I don’t think that because the law was not codified, that there was not law in force. There was – this is why Cain sinned when he slew his brother. This is why Pharaoh was judged and destroyed due to his sin.
And what about the believers who did not turn Peter in when he escaped from prison? Do you not think that there was a command by Herod for people to reveal the whereabouts of this escaped convict? And do you not think that the saints disobeyed this law by lying and not revealing the truth of where he was hiding or that they had seen him?
Personally, if I’m asked to reveal the whereabouts of believers some day whom I known to be hiding somewhere, I will not turn them in and will follow the lead of Rahab and the Egyptian midwives.
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Praise God for a preacher that will preach the truth of God’s word! God only saves bad people… he doesn’t save Good people… Jesus doesn’t want my righteousness… I want HIS!
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