If you can’t wear it to church, then you shouldn’t wear it to the beach either. God does not change his standards because sand and/or water is present.
-Jeremy Sonnier
Christ Alone Wyoming
Proclaiming the Truth of Christ-Centered Theology
If you can’t wear it to church, then you shouldn’t wear it to the beach either. God does not change his standards because sand and/or water is present.
-Jeremy Sonnier
Christ Alone Wyoming 
I love it! This is what I have been saying for years! Finally someone put it in a way that no one can argue with…of course someone will, but the point is, yes, God’s standards don’t change and He deems morality and modesty the same regardless of the environment. Bravo!
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Isn’t this like being judgmental? As long as I am honoring God and being a testimony to those other people around me who are also almost naked on the beach, isn’t that all that is required of me?
I have always wondered why the same people who would not be willing to strip down to their underwear on a public street or even at church, why they would be willing to do so at a beach?!?! Oh, sorry, it must be all the bright colors that make the difference!
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No, DP, actually it’s more like “being all things to all people” and “relating to them to win them.”
:o)
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Sounds good, what a witty quote. Hurrah.
But lets really think about it….am I going to wear slacks and a jacket to go the beach? NO. Be honest and THINK. Nothing wrong with wearing shorts and t-shirts to the beach.
Perhaps Mr. Sonnier should read quote 764, I think his quote falls into that category although its not scripture. And yes I believe that many mens and womens swim wear is too revealing…and so do you and most non believers.
BTW, I was broken 14 months ago after spending 18 years in a good church. God used a family event to break me and draw me near to Him, how fortunate I am. I like this site and the last 14 months have honed my spidey sense and i can smell lukewarm churchy stuff a milie away….AND I can smell stupid quotes like this one too….with all due respect THINK. thank you
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Norm – I am not sure when the last time was that you went to the beach, but I can assure you folks are not wearing shorts and t-shirts.
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Norm,
I am afraid your comments miss the point. I would state that this gentleman has made a valid point about holiness and our appearance before the world. That would not qualify this comment as “stupid” or “lukewarm churchy stuff” – unless you would be one of those who believe they can listen to whatever type of music, where whatever kind of clothes, speak whatever comes to your mind, watch whatever flickers on the silver screen — and then still claim to be a Christian for whom Christ died and for whom the Father has predestinated to be conformed to the image of His Beloved Son!
I would add that if the allure of the beach means I have to subject my eyes and the eyes of my young men to what is found there, then it would be far better to maintain the integrity and purity of our minds by not going! Take a hike in the mountains instead!
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Actually, not such a good comparison. While it’s true that the Lord’s standard does not change from place to place, the activity one engages in does have some influence on what one wears. This is not to defend what passes as swim wear most places – clearly beyond the pale. But let’s not equate “Sunday best” to every day, all activities.
When I ride my motorcycle to church, I wear jeans and boots. When I drive a car, I wear regular pants and shoes.
So while there are standards of decency that line up with the Word of God, even appropriate beach wear is not appropriate for church.
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I think we can safely say that if one was to go swimming, they wouldn’t be wearing a suit, and it is also safe to say (I hope) that if one was to go to church, he/she wouldn’t wear a swimsuit. The point I believe is being missed, or gleaned over is this: What on earth is a self-professing Christian who has supposedly dedicated his life to purity and self-denial going to a place where the customary dress code is non existent? It’s all about purity and holiness, people, and if you can stand there and tell me that you can go to the beach and surround yourself with all of that lewdness and still remain undefiled…then you are not being honest with yourself and you are living a lie.
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revival…
You err in thinking that one’s circumstance defile him. With your logic, you shold live as monk – yet the sin in your heart and mind would still defile you.
Yes, Christians should not walk in temptation. Not all beaches are near nudist enclaves.
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Circumstances do not defile man, Manfred, but environments do. Easy to prove. Go take a job in a porn shop for a year and tell me that after a year of dealing with that smut on a daily basis you aren’t a different person. Tell me that you won’t talk different, view women differently and think differently. Why? We know why. Bad company corrupts good morals and going places where you know are geared toward a certain environment will corrupt and defile. Yes our hearts and minds are corrupt and vile, that can only be helped is through living a life of separation from the world. The New Testament is full of this concept. We have no business being in the world. Yes we must live, work and conduct our lives using the world’s resources, but it should stop there. I have placed barriers up to protect myself from being defiled. I don’t go to certain places where I know I will be inundated with promiscuity. I don’t go to the beach, bars, movie theaters, malls etc. Why? If we viewed sin as a contagious disease, we wouldn’t be asking why and we definitely would be having this conversation.
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revival…
We have ALL the business of the Gospel being in the world. You lean on human reasoning to make your point. Matthew 15:16 – 20 show us what comes out of a man is what defiles him. Yes, as Proverbs makes clear – bad company corrupts good morals. So I agree with you – as stated earlier – that Christians ought not tempt themselves. That’s a far cry from sitting in judgment on one another for not having the same weakness for sin as you or who don’t follow your rules. Your rules are for you. The Bible is for all.
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“We have ALL the business of the Gospel being in the world…”
Yes this is true. We are here on earth to advance the kingdom of God and bring Him glory. But I was not talking about evangelism, I was talking about living life. Enjoying the entertainment and tasting the delicacies of the world. Does one go to the beach and witness? Does one go to the movie theater and tell others about Jesus, Salvation and Hell? Does one go to strip clubs to evangelize (well actually they do, sigh)…my point is this, sin is contagious. The more you do anything, the more you want to do it and the more you become accustomed to it. My reasoning comes from God’s word where we are told to get out from among them, separate ourselves…how does salt lose it effectiveness? By being exposed to the world. We do not have a license to live as the world lives.
The church is designed to be in the world like a boat is designed to be in the water. However, the boat is in trouble when the water gets into it as much as the church is in trouble when the world gets into it. Well, like water in a boat, the world has been seeping into the visible church for quite awhile now, and it’s sinking. This quote is true with us as well, for we make up the church. The more “world” we allow into us, the more we become like them…and sink.
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revival,
You are all over the place. Some of your good points (the character of the church for example) are not on the topic of this post or your earlier comments. I was in the grocery store this evening – there were women dressed like trollops there. Should I never return to the grocery store?> It’s full of worldlings, temptations abound. Again – are you advocating we become monks?
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I do believe going to the beach can absolutely stir up lustful thoughts that wouldn’t be stirred had one not gone to the beach. For instance, in you see a blonde in a g-string bikini, what will you do. That split second that you lay eyes on her will be used by Satan as he rewinds that image over and over in your mind the rest of the day, and possibly longer than that. Yes, what you do with that thought is crucial. Do you dwell on that image, or do you open God’s word and fill your mind with truth, which flushes out filth. This is a temptation that would never have happened had you stayed away from the beach. Should you live as a monk, no!! BUT, you should not place yourself in situations that would stir up ungodly thoughts. Both men and women purposely dress provocatively at public beaches; after all, the beach is filled with lost sinners. I recall our Lord saying if your eye causes you to sin, pluck it out, etc. Now, if our Lord emphasized the need to avoid temptation at all costs, shouldn’t we heed His warning.
Going to the grocery store doesn’t compare to going to the beach where, for the most part, too much skin is revealed. I certainly don’t expect to see a man in a speedo when I go grocery shopping. If I were to go to a beach, or a public pool, I know what to expect.
Common sense, or discernment as it is called for believers, will guide you to avoid situations or circumstances that may cause you to sin.
Perhaps a visit to the beach should be planned on a day when the beach will be less crowded. I personally see no reason to lay in the sand and get tanned, it all seems a bit vain to me. I used to worry about my tan, but I now see the shallowness in that.
If you think you are so strong in your walk with Christ you can go to beaches and not be affected by the amount of bare skin along with body parts being exposed that shouldn’t be, then you are a better man/woman than me!
I won’t go to certain public events/restaurants that sell alcohol, not because I am ‘too good’, but because I once struggled with alcohol. I am indeed free, but, I also know the tempter desires continually to cause me to stumble. Rather than give him a foothold, I prefer to steer clear.
Lyn
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Lyn said:
Spot on.
No one here is advocating a monastic lifestyle. And no one here is saying that if you take your family to an outing that you must all wear three-piece suits and sun dresses. But neither should we accept stripping down to our bare essentials in public settings simply because other people do it (and some even go shopping that way).
I also don’t believe anyone here is claiming modest dress (in and out of church) is a requirement of salvation (that would be legalism), but I would suggest that it is one of the results of salvation.
It’s true we all have a sin nature (thanks Adam!) that defiles us even if we were born on a desert island and had no outside influences to sway us. However, this does not mean that because of this, we now have “license” and should craft a vessel to float over to the next desert island full of bikini-clad girls, purposely placing ourselves in a situation where our inherited sinful nature can be “fertilized.”
– Pilgrim
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Exchange the premise of beachgoing for imbibing intoxicating libations and watch the fireworks fly this Fourth of July!
I’m a little surprised that no one in this thread has made reference to Romans 14 or Colossians 2:16-23. Christian liberty is a glorious thing, only let us not use it as an occasion for sin – Galatians 5:13.
Although I’m not usually one to find myself seeking middle ground, a believer’s liberty in Christ demands great balance. On the one side lies the snare of legalism, and on the other side lies the pit of libertinism. Going too far in either direction often leads to equally spiritually disastrous results.
May we walk in a manner worthy of the high calling of Christ.
“I have made a covenant with my eyes; how then could I gaze at a virgin?” – Job 31:1
To the pure, all things are pure, but to the defiled and unbelieving, nothing is pure; but both their minds and their consciences are defiled. – Titus 1:15
In Christ,
CD
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Having just returned from vacation where there was a nearby beach, I can say that Christian women desiring to be modest and Christian men desiring to keep their minds pure are going to have problems on both fronts if they want to spend time there. We’re talking nakedness as the norm. If you wouldn’t parade around in your underwear in front of other men, Christian women, why would you do so in even less at the beach? We’re followers of Christ–we are different. At no point can you biblically justify nakedness in public places. I can enjoy the sun and being on the water without in any way being immodest, and I don’t mean wearing a burka either. My husband and I managed to greatly enjoy our sun-drenched vacation without having to hit the beach with hundreds of undressed girls, women and men.
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This is my point exactly, thank you Ingrid. We are different, peculiar, unique, set aside…we should not WANT to expose ourselves to the “potential” of seeing things that WILL desensitize us. Because the more we allow in, the more we are desensitized to the sin, the more we are willing to see in the future. Perfect example, check out the horror movies from 50 years ago and check out a horror movie of today. People are desensitized to blood and guts and producers have to constantly be coming up with subject matter that will have some sort of an effect. This is certainly true with Christians of today. The moral fabric of a Christian today would be an absolute disgrace to a Christian such as Wesley or Edwards of yesteryear. We are different and we should be making efforts to shun anything that would put us in a place where we might be sullied. Take that to whatever extent you are convicted to, each one of us will be held accountable for our choices and actions one day.
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I can avoid the beach. I can avoid the mall. I can avoid cable television (although that’s more difficult because it seems TVs are everywhere nowadays). I can avoid public pools. I can avoid the gym. I can avoid many places where one knows that immodest dress (and behavior) will be on display.
But what happens when it’s in the church? I am not speaking hypothetically. I was somewhat taken aback by how the women were so immodestly dressed yesterday (as well as the pastor’s daughter); especially when we had friends visiting and they had four boys (ages 7 to 17) in attendance as well as my young children. None of them needed to be exposed to that, none of them needed to be tempted by that, and none of them needed to be conditioned to think that this is the way (Christian) women are to dress and be looked upon.
And you know if we say anything the initial knee-jerk response will be “don’t be legalistic.” I am just wondering what the rest of us (who don’t view Sunday as a fashion show) are to do.
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Amen, and thanks!
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